Thursday, 21 October 2010

David Jeremiah Does it Again

Just finished listening to David Jeremiah's show on the radio.
Dr Jeremiah is, of course, a committed pre-tribulation rapturist. But on his show last night he quoted the very passage to make his point that I firmly believe refutes it.
Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the day of the Lord has already come. Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. (2 Thes 2:1-3)

He said that the first verse is clearly speaking of the rapture which, if I were in his camp, I would agree with. But then he leapt to the conclusion, and I am basically quoting him here, that this passage proves that the church will be gone before the antichrist appears! My response was an incredculous, "What ??????"
He walked word for word through the passage and then insisted on his point. What am I missing?

I'm afraid I just can't understand how someone could be so blind. Either he is seeing something I don't, and I am blind, or he is so overtaken by his pre-trib position that he, at least in this case, just doesn't see the clear teaching of Scripture. The passage clearly states that our being gathered together with Christ (the rapture) does not occur until after a rebellion (a falling away or apostasy) and the revealing of the man of lawlessness (the antichrist) is revealed.

As I have said before, there are a lot of well-known and high profile Christians in the pre-trib, or "left behind" camp, and I think that this is a most dangerous teaching, even if one subscribes to a premillenial return of Christ.

Because even if the pre-mil position is true, then teaching that the church will be gone when the man of lawlessness is revealed leaves their followers wide open for deception. If the antichrist arrives on the scene, and believers are still on the earth (as I believe is the logical Scriptural conclusion of the pre-mil position, proven by this very passage), then all those who have believed the pre-trib position will not believe that he is, indeed, the antichrist, because they will have been told all this time that he couldn't be. They will have been told by teachers they admire that they will be gone when he comes.

I believe these teachers should be careful about how adamantly they preach their beliefs, and acknowledge that their position may not be quite the certainty they insist it is.

Take Care


Anonymous said...

Several Google pieces are well worth perusing. They are "Famous Rapture Watchers," "Pretrib Rapture Diehards," "Pretrib Rapture Secrecy," "Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty," and "Thieves' Marketing" (the last one is about David Jeremiah). Shocks galore!

unohu said...

Brother "John K"- You ARE "missing something" in 2 Thes. 2:1-3. Some false teachers had been deceiving Thessalonica Believers that "they have MISSED it!" The Day of the Lord already has begun. -- NO, Paul declares, because the "man of lawlessness" has not appeared. They can know therefore that they have not MISSED "being gathered to Him," because they will be taken up BEFORE he emerges. It is likely they were under persecution, and some were claiming: "AHA!" See? -Antichrist is in action. Your "rapture" didn't happen.

John K said...

"The Day of the Lord already has begun." -- NO, Paul declares, because the "man of lawlessness" has not appeared."
Precisely! The Day of the Lord will not begin until after the man of lawlessness is revealed.
"That day" is associated (verse 1)with, "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him."
Nothing I can see in this passages guarantees we will be taken up before this man emerges.

Courtney Gaines said...

I absolutely agree with you John. good for you for reading the verses for yourself and letting the Holy Spirit interpret it for you, rather than taking the popular beliefs of men, no questions asked.

Anonymous said...

It is frightening what some of our "spiritual leaders" are teaching. It appears as though they are skipping parts of the Bible, believing the lies that they have been taught and are mindlessly passing those teachings on. Or simply soft-selling the Word of God in order to a) not offend people, so they can
b) maintain their numbers, thus, contributors to their church fund, and
C) choosing to IGNORE the Word of God outright.

One example is the celebration of Pagan festivals, i.e. X mas. It is not Biblical. Jeremiah 10:1-5

Chiva said...

Ten Virgins, ALL Virgins expecting the same great event. Five FOOLISHLY assumed the bridegroom would come early in the night and di not prepare for a Long, Drawn Out Night. The SIN is PRESUMPTION. Never ASSUME your bridegroom will come quickly or before the night gets very Dark and Long. Unfortunately for the Five Foolish (who started out with the same intentions as the Wise Virgins), they do not make it in to the Wedding Feast and are actually CAST OUT and told by the Bridegroom "I know you not". How scary is that??

I've actually been told by a die-hard, died-in-the-wool Pre-Tribber that "God loves her too much to allow her to suffer in a tribulation" and that's how she knows it's Pre-Trib rapture. How deceived are these people? Time will tell.

american said...

I am not certain if the rapture occurs pre trib or mid tribe. Certainly not post trib. The bible is very clear on that. BUT, I know that arguing this point is not the way of the Lord. What we know for sure is that Jesus Christ tells us to always be ready to meet him and that NO man knoweth the hour. What we really should be focused on is being ready to meet Christ and to witness to all. DON'T get caught up in arguments of humaness. SATIN loves that. I have received many awesome teachings from Dr. JEREMIAH whether he is write or wrong on this.

american said...

Anonymous is frightful. You you trashing people who teach Jesus.Do you know him. Ask Jesus into your heart. Then have him show you the love of Jesus. Your words show u are missing all that is important. Meet Jesus, he loves u.

Anonymous said...

Sorry, I see the point he was trying to make. If the first part is the rapture, the second piece in the paragraph says (paraphrasing) "This day will not come until the antichrist is revealed. The man DOOMED to destruction."

The words 'revealed' and 'doomed' are telling me that on the day that the lord comes, THEN he will be revealed. How can he create chaos and havoc without being revealed yet?